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  CSPAN    Washington Journal    News/Business. Live morning call-in program with  
   government officials, political leaders, and journalists.  

    February 23, 2013
    7:00 - 10:00am EST  

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and harvard medical school -- harvard medical school's george church discusses mapping the human brain. host: the obama ministration has asked the supreme court to strike down the key part of the marriage act. the pentagon has temporarily grounded a powerful fleet of fire jets over a discovered crack in the engine blades. six tanks at a nuclear site holding radioactive waste are leaking. the do not pose an immediate threat to public safety. good morning, it is "the washington journal." our first 45 minutes this morning, we are going to ask you
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about paid sick leave. lawmakers in six states are trying to make paid six time -- paid sick time our requirement. 25% of par to employees to not get paid sick days. we are asking you, should paid sick days be a federal mandate? if you want to reach out was on social media, you can tweet us. we have 35, is already on facebook. and you can always e-mail us at urnal@cspan.org
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legislators step up for paid sick leave. some pretty 9% of private-sector workers are not entitled to paid time off when they fall ill according to the bureau of labor statistics. low-wage and part-time workers, particularly those who work at small firms or who work in restaurants, are among the least likely to get paid sixth time. to change that, democratic lawmakers and their allies in maryland, washington, and massachusetts, and cities including new york, philadelphia, and portland, or try to advance measures that would make a sixth time a legal requirement for most firms. in congress, senator tom harkin plans to reintroduce a federal paid sick leave bill this spring. some employers contend the
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measure has harmed workers with company wage and increase -- which by prompting cuts in wages or increases. we are asking you about the federal government and if there should be a federal mandate when it comes to paid sick days. here is how you can reach out to us, on our phone lines, all with 8202 area code. -- all with a 202 area code. you can tweet us @cspanwj and you can always send us a facebook comment. "the wall street journal" included a graphic breaking down how sick week -- how sick leave works for workers. 75% of full-time workers, 23% of
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part-time workers. it also brings a dumb but business sizes. for those 500 or more, 80% of the workers get paid sick leave. 66% for 100 to four hundred 99. if you have 99 or fewer employees, only 52% saying they get paid time off. senator opted -- senator harkin wrote an op-ed on this. that is our topic to you. if you think government should or should not do it, please tell us why. we will go to florida, independent line. chuck is up first. good morning. caller: i think paid sick leave should remain a perk. everything i do is based on production.
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if i am not to their producing, this company -- how can you possibly not go out of business if you are paying me not to do anything. that is the question in all of this. host: bob from philadelphia, pennsylvania on the republican line. good morning. caller: good morning. first-time caller. i am the estimates how people think that people -- how people think that businesses can absorb repeated attempts to increase costs and stay in business. it is just galling. i cannot believe that lawmakers, especially guys like tom harkin,
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who are not stupid people, would even consider this. there are some businesses they enough to absorb these costs and ethically they should. but for the most part most businesses cannot. mr. harkin and other lawmakers should consider that. host: what businesses could absorbent and what businesses cantor? caller: there are large multinationals that have large income streams that obviously could. but there are many small businesses, such as fast-food restaurants and the like, who could not possibly do it. i think that is the difference. host: i guess one would argue why penalize those for something that everybody -- that happens to everyone as far as getting sick is concerned. caller: that is fine, but in a perfect utopian world everybody
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would get this perk. but we do not live in a utopian world. that is the difference. businesses that can bear the cost should ethically do that and the smaller ones who cannot, they just cannot. that is the difference. host: 8 "wall street journal" stores as philadelphia is one of the places pushing for this idea. caller: that is not surprising h. host: why is that? caller: i know the political mind-set here. it is a feast of rules for democrats. host: that is of from philadelphia, pennsylvania. senator harkin advocating this legislation, he is the chairman of the committee of health, labor, and pension.
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this from politico, sick leave is essential for the work force. as children we are taught a set of basic common courtesies to prevent the spread of disease. and as the national flu epidemic worsens, health experts and elected officials alike are now urging adults to do the same, advising people to stay home from work if they are ill. but the reality is that stayed home from work for several days to recuperate and recover from the flu -- or something worse -- is challenging or impossible for tens of millions of americans. 40 percent of private-sector workers have no access to paid sick days, meaning that they cannot miss a day of work without risking a day's pay or even risking their job. so these hard-working people must make an impossible choice. the senator rights --
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with that in mind, should there be a federal mandate for paid sick days? winchester, tennessee. democrats line, tina hello. caller: hello. i know a lot of small businesses may be cannot afford it. you miss today's, the third day you have the chance of losing your job. host: you probably heard some of the comments from the employers
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perspectives. what do you think about that and how it affects the employer in the run? caller: ida's woke up and saw this on television. i think that you can afford to do it. a lot of people cannot afford to miss work. a lot of people are scared they will lose their jobs. if you work in a factory, a lot of people do not take care. there are germs. you touch with you got to touch. host: if you work, what is the policy on paid sick days where you work? caller: if you have more than three days you bring a dr.'s
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excuse or you are not excused. host: if you are off and you are sick, you get paid? caller: no. host: expected this morning saying -- world is on from ohio -- earl is on from ohio. caller: ipad is wanted to say with all these taxes going on, people get sick and they work hard these long hours. i think there should be it
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federal mandate. host: tell me about your situation. how does it play out at work? caller: my situation right now is i require -- i have problems in my back. i to get out of checks like social security and medicare. host: just a reminder, if you are listening at home turn down your tvs. if you get feedback and there is the light, we want to keep people into this conversation. from twitter -- a position column on this from february 6 --
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he comments on senator harkin's proposal saying parker claims that greater amount of productivity is lost from workers coming to work sick than from staying home, but this is plainly nonsense. we are asking you if the federal government should mandate paid sick days. senator harkin making a
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proposal. you heard some opinions on it. john from ohio, republican line. caller: this administration has the highest unemployment practically ever. and they do not seem to want to leave any block unturned to cost small businesses everything it possibly can. get out of our face. it has got to stop. every day there is a new way they want to get you for more taxes and more money. small businesses in the midwest are barely holding on. and that is not because of people like john casey. but he has the federal government slapping him in the face of a chance they can get. it just have to stop. host: when it comes to the specific proposal for paid time off, what are your concerns about it? caller: it is the cost of doing business. ibm is not going to have a
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problem with that. a small manufacturing plant of 25 people make. it costs jobs. every time the federal government -- a if the costs increase you have to increase your prices or you have to start losing people. mr. obama does not seem to understand business. that is the problem of legislators and our government officials. none of them have been in business. that is the problem in this country. 0 host: if you are a small business owner, feel free to do so. if you work at a place where you do not get paid sick days, give us your comments as well. the numbers will be on your screen. we had 35 postings of facebook before we posted the question. let me read you a couple of them.
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um if you want to make your fop -- your thoughts known on facebook, you can post there. for those of you and hanging on the line, jason will be up in illinois in a bit. but michael is up first from tennessee on the democrats' line. good morning. caller: i am a self-employed person in national, tennessee. it amazes me the small business people calling in and wining. i bet when they get sick at that they take their day off and leave their work to somebody else until the get back to work. and i bet they get paid. i bet that they are not willing to give up any other profits to have happier employees. happier employees are better
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workers. all the ceos, they get paid for health care and they always want to cut the lower worker out. this is horrible. this is where america is going. you leave it to the conservatives they will take away your health care, you will lose your job. this is not the america we want to live in. that is why we are going liberal. we do not want to live in fear and lose everything. we want to make things better for everyone. host: jason from illinois on the independent line. caller: good morning. when the government gets involved on these small issues the turn into big ones eventually. at the end of world war two, some companies came up with an
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idea that they were going to benefit their employees because they were competing for employees and they came up with this idea of providing health care instead of continually raising the wages. now you know what we have today. you go down and the insurance -- you get a bill from the hospital now. it is a big vicious circle. you get a bill that's as $8,000 you owe them -- you do not know your insurance company only pays them $5,000. i might have been able to swing the five and not pay $800 per month in my insurance. continually the government getting involved creates all these different monsters. host: what are your thoughts on amended for pay this is a critic for paid sick days specifically? caller: on paid sick days i say no.
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no more government mandates. if i say i am starting a grass cutting company tomorrow, we are all going to sign this paper and i am going to pay $3 an hour with no sick days -- it should be the individuals took this -- the individual's choice. that is really all i have to say. host: here is from "politico" this morning --
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the sequester the story referred to is set to take place next friday, march 1. all next week we will look at the department's and how the sequester will affect those. the defense department being one of them. a story about the defense department in "the washington post," -- some specification comes from
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the last column over -- paid sick days is what we are talking about for the next 20 minutes. this is pam from ashland, ohio on the republican line. caller: we have a small business, 21 families. i am particularly offended by tennessee gentlemen saying that small business people to not coming to work when they are sick. i do not know what model he is looking at.
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the bottom line is simple, if we are mandated to provide a certain amount of sick leave, you are going to lose a job. somebody somewhere is going to be cut out of having an actual job. he referred to a happy employees. we have the trust relationship. if they are sick they do not come to work. if they are welcome to work. when you give people days that they basically look at to use, your productivity goes down. there is no model for productivity in this. once again it is government interference and it is when the cost jobs. for some reason the opposition to looking at reality of small business just won't consider the option that there will be less jobs. host: what is your business? how many employees do you have?
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caller: 21 people. we are a contract -- we are insurance for a construction company. there is not any room. as insurances go up, keeping our people in good health -- the owners take many sacrifices. there is some kind of class warfare going on in this country that if you are productive and to invest -- we have significant investments. it is your name, your money, your house. host: if employee is sick, do they have to prove they are sick? caller: and no, we have good employees. -- they't not do that do not do that. we are in the heartland. this is a good work ethic area.
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people want to work. they want a good paid top. they know if they are sick bishop stay home. host: its home construction? caller: industrial. host: thank you for your perspective. louisville, ky on our democrats line, they keep for waiting. good morning. caller: good morning. i have a job and we do not have sick days at all. if we are sick we have to prove we are sick. i cannot come back until i had a doctor's note. i could not go to work the next
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day, causing me to lose bonuses. i work for a small firm that is a family owned business. we do not have sick days. host: if you are sick, you did not get paid that day? caller: we get sent home, we lose our bonus money that they offer us. we are just at a loss. we have to prove we are sick. host: what size is the company? caller: we have about 19 employees. host: what kind of work is it? caller: debt collection? . if you are sick they still want to hear causing everyone else to be sick. host: the rochester business
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journal did a survey taking a look at survey -- taking a look at sick days and what should be done in new york. they write -- that is the perspective from new york state. we are talking about a federal mandate for paid sick days. you can call the lines and give your opinion. this is kevin on the republican
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line. caller: i think this whole issue requires much more study. let us get back to the basics. the whole idea of business, -- anything adverse to that, there should be things in place such as insurance. i think perhaps, rather than paid sick leave, maybe the employee can help some of the purposing an insurance policy in case the employee is stick -- is sick and the employer can receive some compensation for losses of that employee.
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if we can arrive at a solution that is both amicable to the employer and the employee host: if the employee has more skin in the game -- caller: absolutely. you said it right there. the minimum wage issue in which the employers always carries the cost. the administration always as we need more jobs. the entire government are taking steps that are just one-sided. the employer is constantly bearing the costs, and yet they want more employment ship.
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host: "the seattle times" this morning has a story when it toxic materials at a waste site. the nation's most contaminated cold war weapons producing facility --
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host: this is lloyd from wouldn't know, washington. caller: our company is a small business. we already offer personal time off. we offer about 20 days per year. the reason we do that is partly because of the competitive environment and the high-tech era. i do not mind personal time off. what i would appreciate from the federal government would be could they use that as an offset on the quotes revenues of the company to bring down taxes a little bit for offering this? i would ask things like training -- we try to get our employees trained. they could offer that as a tax deduction to the company. there are some r&d tax credits that the administration wants to
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put on small businesses to offer all of these programs. it would be great to get some assistance on the other side. host: you are the ceo of the company? what does the employee size? caller: 18 employees. host: could you tell me what business you are in? caller: we are in soccer tweeted we are in software development. host: use it 20 personal days, could that be used for anything? caller: it could be vacation or sick day. host: go-ahead. caller: the last thing i would say is this is a difficult thing in january times when revenues are difficult. a lot of ceos and presidents of small companies, when times are
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difficult, they do not get a salary. i would offer that as a comment to one of the persons calling earlier. host: mike is next in illinois on the independent line. caller: hello. i work for a company here in illinois. we have about 3000 employees. they give us five personal days per year unpaid. i believe the government is overreaching and we do not need any more government. that is all i have to say. host: you get five personal unpaid days? give us an example, if you feel like taking time off or if you are sick you can use those days did you do not get paid for it? caller: correct. host: but he did not get penalized either? caller: no. if we do have a sick day, we do have to bring in a doctor's note.
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that is pretty reasonable, i think. that is all i have to say. host: the employer bears all the costs because the employer bears all the profits. if you are a ceo or an employee, the topic is paid sick days. should it be a federal mandates? we read some of beds. we have about 10 more minutes on this topic. we will go to steven from buffalo, wyoming. republican line, hello. caller: i work in the construction industry. we are affected by weather and all kinds of stuff we do not get paid for. if somebody wants to get paid -- it is pure greed. they are greedy, they do not want to do something for the money they get. they just want somebody to give
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it to them. let's make it a mandate. that is not right. i did not care how you look at it. host: there are some arguments about what is the value of having an employee because they cannot use the money when they -- and they can make other people sick. caller: i can understand keeping a position open and available. i have not worked for a company that would terminate somebody because they were sick. last year i had a stroke. i missed a week's work of work -- worth of work. because of federal mandated insurance, i have not paid 1 cent yet of my bill. i have $12,000 worth of bills in
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the bank. with the federal mandated insurance, not paying a penny. host: here is a story taking a look at citizenship on the larger topic of immigration. the story goes on to say --
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steve is up next from ohio on the democrats' line. caller: i am favor in a federal mandated sickly. with respect to small employers -- basic the ones who have called and, they would not be affected by this law. they would be doing the right thing. the second reason is a health and safety issue. i work with local government. i see how people ask us to do things like this, to put basic standards of living for
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everyone and in the country. the of the level the playing field. i just think it makes common sense for small businesses to want to have this. finally, if you are an employee and you have to work two minimum-wage jobs and do not have sick leave, it is hard for you. you do not want to miss a day. your kids are sick or you are sick, a lot of people barely make enough money to get by in this country. they go to work six and tied. if the players to this voluntarily, small businesses should see the light and get on board with this. host: hundred 30 responses on our facebook page. here is one of them --
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of twitter, "absolutely not. who's better positioned to negotiate sick days, a man and his employer or politicians in dc? caller: my feeling on the sick days is that if people cannot afford to take a day off maybe we should look at the things that are making it difficult for them to take a day off because they are sick. that would be the cost of fuel, the cost of food, the cost of everything that has gone up since obama has been in office but even before him. everything keeps going up. maybe we ought to look at that. did the government out of the small businesses. they do not belong there. host: from illinois on the
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republican line. caller: one size does not fit all. everything has to be federal. my dad started a small business years ago. he trained as so many people and he could not afford to give them sick days. if you cannot afford to take a sick day, there is something wrong with everything else. i filled my grandson's casting guest today. we cannot even afford anything host: how much did you pay? caller: $50. host: what is the per gallon cost? caller: i did not even look.
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i get tired of the federal government thinking all states are different. one size does not fit all. somebody said doubled the playing field, what the heck? a lot ofmy dad's -- people he hired would not have had a job. there were so underqualified but he trained them. everybody has their hand out. host: in a couple of minutes we are going to talk -- democratic governors met with the president is today, talking about various topics including the sequester. we are going to be talking with governor jack markell.
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later on we will deal with the topic of domestic drone use in the united states. , we are:15 segment w going to talk with the top brain researcher from harvard. i do want to alert you, 9:00 on this coming monday it is martha washington -- our first lady's series, influence and image. you will see places they lived, you will hear from experts who studied their lives. it is a part of our "first lady
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" series. new haven, conn. democrats line. good morning. caller: the republican party has had a 40 year war on the middle class. host: the point? caller: 40 your war on the middle-class by the republican party. host: how does that relate to paid sick days? caller: when you kill the unions, you lose your part -- you lose your bargaining power. they lose their authority. they complain about the government but they do not mind being run over by politicians and the corporations. the corporations are like super citizens and people are like a ons.
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host: as far as a mandate on paid sick days, your thoughts? caller: i work at a railroad company that both had unions. we do not get sick days. if the government does not do it, we do not get it. host: some employers to give businesses -- some employers to benefit, some don't. george from the independent line. good morning. caller: good morning. very interesting topic. i am an old man. i have been an employer and i have been an employee. a couple of things i like to mention. this discussion is worthy of airing.
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the fact the government has anything to do with it is totally absurd. this is unconstitutional. we have a constitution. dealing with people's individual sick days is not a proper function of the federal government. the constitution is very simple to read. the oath that our politicians and our government officials take to uphold the constitution is not a secret of it. it is quite open. host: why not offer to take sick days aside from the constitution? caller: as i mentioned i was an employer for over 50 years in arizona. i can tell you that the relationship is it is a fair
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exchange of consideration. if someone were to be paid for not working -- it is like if you had a favorite restaurant where you went every morning to have breakfast. if you did not have breakfast because you're sick one morning, you go in and paid for the meal any help. the businessman pace for that portion of their life. what that person produces is beneficial to that business. it is not a social or welfare program. it is plain and simply old american free enterprise business. these other things need to be taken up on a social level or a private level. host: can i ask you a question -- as an employee if there were a federal protection offering
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paid sick days, if sun employees think they are going to take a sick day even though they are not sick? caller: we are human. of course. there's no question about it. what i am saying is this is not government. human beings are human beings. they are going to get what they can get. they are going to further their own nests. this is not a proper function of government. when it comes to free enterprise there is nothing the government can do except make it worse. the only thing they have done is made it worse. host: when you were an employer, how did you treat sick days? caller: most of the employees we had were on a salary basis. i guess they did get paid for sick days.
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if i found that they were not sick, they did not have a job. host: charlie, thank you for holding on. this is from ohio. caller: this is a very horrible idea. for one thing, the government cannot do it. article one of the constitution lays out powers of the federal government. as far as i can tell that is not in there. maybe the state of ohio could do it. but not the federal government. all powers are deferred to states. but also, they do not have to do
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this. the private sectors have already come up with a solution. my employer went with an insurance company that if you are sick for at least eight work days straight you start getting paid. you get paid by the insurance company. the solution is already out there. all of this cost of living and such, whose fault is that? it's really nobody's. the government is getting its regulations and laws into everything. for most of the stuff it shouldn't. what are we going to have to do? find out who is voting for these kinds of things and next sunday are up for election, vote them out.
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failing that we have the second amendment, which is meant to fight against tyranny. host: will leave it there. mike, madison indiana, democrats line. caller: i want to reiterate about the unions. if it weren't for the unions, people would not have sick days. it would not have workers' comp. it would not have anything that -- they would not have anything like that. we own a small business. i am a union carpenter. i have real properties. i pick out the nose for insurance.
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we pay workers' comp. i think we should let the insurance companies pay for the sick days. of course that will open up a can of beans to let the insurance companies dictate. but it seems like a dictator anyway. let the insurance companies pay for sick days. host: what of business are you in that caller: we have a flower shop. host: how many employees? caller: 3. host: tell us what happens -- you talked about your experience -- do you think this topic it offers -- do you think this topic difference forests mall companies and large companies? caller: it is something that is going to be drawn out, let us see a doctor's note. large businesses may have large turnovers.
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it is a pretty tough call since all employers are generally paying workers' comp. let the insurance company paid two sick days. host: trinidad joins us from phoenix, arizona on the independent line. go ahead. caller: i wanted to comment on this. i think it should be federally mandated. it would correlate with compensation and unemployment language. this would compel states to provide this oversight should an employee truly need sick time, down time.
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most employees cannot afford insurance and a lot of these small businesses do not provide health benefits. the requirement to bring in a dr.'s order for the day you take sick leave -- this is so contradicting in this climate where we may not even call the obama healthcare for all the states. this is a public health issue. if a worker is truly sick they will stay home. they need their jobs so they would go to work if they were able to.
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host: that is the last call we will take. that was trinidad from phoenix, arizona. we appreciate all who participated this morning. this week the national governors' association hosts their winter's meeting not too far from here. joining us to talk about a variety of topics, gov. jack markell. he serves as the chair of the national governors' association. on the front page of "the new york times," there is a story relating to a meeting that democrats had to -- the democrats had with the president is today specifically talking about planned budget cuts that are to take place here in washington d.c.. can you give us a sense of what the message was from the guest: president one of the things that is frustrating is that a lot of us feel the economy is coming back. with these cuts potentially
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hitting it could impact our budgets. more importantly it would impact the people in our state. it also impacts businesses, making them less likely -- i think all of us are -- i think all of us would like to get past this. host: did you get that sense? guest: i do not want to characterize it as pessimistic or optimistic. i think he is very focused on getting this passed. one of the biggest challenges has to do with what is the impact of not just on budget and what is the impact on the economy? there are a lot of businesses that are sitting on a lot of cash. the more certain -- the more certain they are the more likely it is they will invest and put people to work. a lot of the conversation with the president was to assert his determination to see a stronger
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middle-class. that is a big part of the focus. guest: taking a look at the meeting that is coming up, issues that are concerning the state. if you want to ask him a question, here is how you can do so -- we set aside a special line for those in delaware. you mention concerns from the state. the lead story in the new york times this morning says specifically that cuts that come from the budget plans will flow into the state. how could delaware be affected? what about your fellow governors? whether they saying? host: there is still some uncertainty about what amounts there would be to the cuts in specific areas. it is everything from st ubstance abuse treatment and
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special education. work-force training as a particular area of frustration. we're so focused on getting people back to work. one of the most frustrating conversations any governor can have is with an employer who says i have got openings but i cannot find people with the right skills. we are focused on work force training. to see that money go away is a particular area of concern and frustration. those are some examples of the areas we are working best we can to prepare for. it would be helpful of the folks here in washington were able to find a solution other than a sequester. host: you mentioned work force training. unemployment in the united states hitting 7.9%. if we understand it correctly, unemployment in your state is 6.9%.
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guest: it is better than the national average but it is not good enough. every day we wake up there -- we are relentlessly focused on people in our state. as we continue to have to focus on. we think the sequester is certainly more hurtful than helpful. host: how are you preparing? guest: our office has been working with the various state agencies. the specifics have not been defined yet at of the federal office of management and budget. we know the magnitude of what could be pcoming. host: what is the partisanship on this issue like? we hear about it on capitol hill but what about dubliners? guest: the chair of the national
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association -- we got a bipartisan delegation. three democrats, three republicans. the real message that we brought that date was it is important that states have a seat at the table, that we are partners in many ways with the federal government, and we want to make sure that the people here in washington were making the decisions and realize that the transfer spending responsibility from the federal government to the state governments. we are not accomplishing much. we are heartened by the response and openness by the president. we look for to continue to having a seat at the table. host: governor markell. you can ask him questions on a
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large scalable. if you are from delaware you can also ask questions. first call is from potomac, maryland. this is norman. caller: i just wanted to make a comment on the people who called and keep callign and talk about these social programs that are not allowed by the constitution. if you just read the pre-amble, it says "we the people -- provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare--"
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host: we are going to leave it there. moses lake, washington. caller: good morning. i have two questions for the governor. why is bill were in such dire need of government has announced -- why is delaware in such dire need of government handouts? what is delaware doing to encourage businesses in delaware? number 3, i would like the governor to comment on businesses across the country where they are doing good in republican states and democratic states. host: caller, thank you. guest: i did not understand the first part, the first question.
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let me talk about jobs in delaware. my view is simple. it is not the role of government to create jobs. we want to create the maturing environment where business is one to relocate. we thought a hundred the blogs visited a hundred businesses in delaware and asked -- we visited 800 businesses in delaware and ask what they wanted. businesses care a lot about the quality of our schools and the quality of our workforce. they care about being in a place where there are reasonable taxes. they care about having a responsive government. they also want to be in a place where there is a good quality of life. there are 3 billion people in the world looking for jobs.
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there are only 1.2 billion jobs available. the businesses and employers have more choices the ever before about when to locate. we try to focus on those issues, making sure we have a good work force and we have good schools. they have to keep can better and better. we have good work force training programs. we are hiring responsibly. we have a reasonable cost of doing business. those things make a huge difference in data are what we are focused on. >> you just -- those things make a huge difference and they are what we are focused on. host: you just came back from a trip to india. best thing i've visited a city
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with a manufacturing plant in delaware. -- guest: i visited a city with a manufacturing plant in delaware. the hot hot -- india is the third fastest-growing source of investment in the united states. as long as they are doing that, but like delaware to get their share. i have had a lot of meetings around that issue. it was encouraging trip. people talk about globalization, but it is real.
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it is here. whether it is india or a company from south korean the thought a poultry farm -- this is the real world we live in. we are opening up 20 immersion schools where students spend half of their school day learning in a different language. we have 340 kindergarten and first grade students who are learning science, social studies, and mass in either chinese or spanish. in 15 or 20 years, it will make a difference. in a global world, and have to make sure we have a workforce that can communicate in languages other than english. host: from delaware, this is
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lands on our republican line. -- lance on our republican line. caller: you have proposed gun legislation in delaware, which would require law-abiding citizens to report within 48 hours the loss or theft of a firearm from their residence. can you explain how you think this will reduce criminal activity or criminal use of guns? guest: sure. there are several pieces of this. oregon proposal should be looked at in the context of three main initiatives. -- power -- our gun proposal should be looked at in the context of three main issue 2 is. we are proposing a tenfold increase -- of our gun proposal
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should be looked at in the context of three main issues. we are making sure every school has a high quality safety plan. there are several pieces of gun safety legislation, one being background checks for all purchases and one of them being the responsibility of within 48 hours of realizing someone has stolen or lost a weapon, to report that. we think this will help with the respect of straw purchases. it is not like anyone of these bills is the ultimate answer, but collectively they can make a difference. it has nothing to do with taking guns away or infringing on the second amendment. the various proposals we have
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made can be helpful collectively. host: what do you think of the proposals the president has made in congress has done to act on those proposals? guest: we cannot just wait to see what happens in washington. host: new orleans, louisiana, independents line. caller: everything is going downward. all of this money is going out of town and having all of these luncheons and dinner parties in my governor in louisiana took 20 troops to different -- trips to different states.
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i am independent. if it is a republican, you are for the rich white person. if you are a democrat, you are for the poor people. host: the specific question? caller: the specific question is why do you cut spending that will help the poor and people in need, the rehabilitation of people get into trouble? guest: if you looked at the budgets from states across the country, over the last me use, the amount of money we spent on health care has been increasing significantly. it is a challenge. we have limited resources at the state level. at the federal level, they can
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borrow to pay operating expenses. we cannot do that. we are required to do a balanced budget. because health care expenses have been increasing so significantly, it has limited what we have believed to spend and reason -- and invest in other areas. other states are working to figure out a way to improve the quality of health outcomes, reduced the cost of health. a lot of people say you cannot do those two things simultaneously. we think you can. the federal department of health and human services made a number of innovation grants to states that are working hard to figure out how to improve health outcomes and reduce costs. states are in a position where we can invest in other areas and return money to taxpayers as appropriate and do everything we can to make our states better.
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host: covenant are deciding if they will expand medicaid under -- governors are deciding if they will expand medicaid under federal requirements. guest: let me explain the medicaid expansion issue. essentially, what it is about with respect to the affordable care act -- in delaware, we made the decision to do think medicare expansion. the government will pick up 100% of the cost in three years can -- within three years. it is based on income. this does a couple of things. more people will have access to good care. otherwise, when people get sick, they get sicker, they do not going to see a health-care professional. they probably can up in
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emergency room, the most expensive place of of for them to give care. this provision will mean more of these people can get access to more expensive primary care at the right time. for the sake of delaware, this move made sense. it is not a democratic or a republican issue. it is an issue of math. for the taxpayers of delaware, it makes sense. there will be a higher reimbursement for medicare. we believe it makes sense financially and in terms of getting more people quality care. host: do you think the government can meet its financial obligations with regard to these expansions? just say i do. it is about trying to do -- guest: i do. we focus more on health outcomes, the warning quality,
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not just compensating for more procedures, but really rewarding quality outcomes. a lot of the interesting work will be the one on in states across the country. one of the things we will be talking about this weekend among the governors is learning from each other about the things happening in our states. host: what is the significance of florida sonny on this week? guest: the state -- host: what is the significance of florida signing on this week? guest: i am not surprised to see more states signing on. the decisions will be left up to their local leadership. host: kristin on our democrats line. caller: governor markell, thanks
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for representing delaware so well. i am comment about the gun legislation you propose. i would like to encourage enforcement of the gun laws. i wanted to advocate for that. associationernors' and the means you are having altogether, are their efforts to collaborate across state lines to enforce gun legislation that have in the different states so we can get moved: along those lines without waiting for -- fsa so we can get things moving along those lines without -- yhr theifferences --
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different mstates m-- mstates -- states so we can get things moving along those lines without waiting for the federal government? guest: a couple of years ago, governor o'malley in maryland invited me to come down with our law enforcement team to focus on cross border law enforcement. that can include gun crimes. that kind of collaboration can be done evil. it is not just about what happens at the federal level. it is about smart policies that the state level. laws may differ from state to state. we are not trying to seek exact consistency across the state. the important thing is we are all trying to figure out how we
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respect the second amendment and keep people say that the same time. host: we go next to hit the earth -- we go next to pittsburgh, pennsylvania. calm how much discretion does the president have in distributing the sequestration cuts to districts and states? -- caller: how much discretion does the president have in this to be the sequestration customs districts and states? guest: it is an interesting question. the office of management and budget is going to have to make some difficult choices about where the cuts are going to fall between security and non-
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security and domestic spending, between various issues. misled not sure i can answer held entrance into the negotiations between congress and the administration -- is also not sure i can answer. those are negotiations between congress and the administration. spending everywhere can be impacted. we have the dover air force base, an important base for us. we have our national guard. we call them our hometown heroes. there is vulnerability. i have been talking about the head of the national guard. there is a therapist of uncertainty. we have to be as nimble as we can possibly as the guidance becomes clear.
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caller: if there are so many tough openings in skilled jumps, why is it the most of -- skilled jobs, why is it that most employers hiring the overqualified. intriguing.em little to the training of these people. -- i have seen them contributing very little to the training of these people. guest: we are working closely between our institutions, k. 12 as well as community colleges and -- k-12 as well as community colleges and local businesses for the following reasons. this is is have a clear sense of the skills they need.
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they have a bias our community colleges and others which equipment to purchase. it would be helpful to them if the people being trained -- they have advised, community colleges and others on which equipment is purchased. we find a tight linkage between our local businesses and our institutions of education. we think that is particularly helpful. host: what does your budget look like for next year and what to assisting you have because of that? guest: it looks tight every year. it is different being governor today than it used to be. in years past, if you were governor, you would have to figure out with members of the legislature how you spend incremental revenues. now you can figure out where you will save in waves that will lead to prosperity in the
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future. -- in ways that will lead to prosperity in the future. he joined finance committee is meeting of the next several weeks. they will spend between now and june 30 adjusting the budget and making improvements to its. we will continue to negotiate with them. -- they will spend now and june 30 adjusting the budget and making improvements to it. we have offered additional after-school activities for kids. several additional state troopers to fight violent crime. those are a few sittings we are focused on now. host: reportedly, there is a budget shortfall. guest: in the end, we have to have a balanced budget. are proposed, in january, a
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balanced budget. it is my responsibility under law. working with the general assembly, we will get there. host: dave from wilmington, delaware on the republican line. caller: thank you for taking my call. my concerns are many. our system is crashing. i was listening to you talking about going to india to court a couple of companies for a couple hundred people who are already here. i was wondering why we could not send you to d.c. and really where police say your tax paying citizenry and straight in washington -- since you to d.c. and her present your tax paying citizenry and -- send you to
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d.c. and represent your tax paying citizenry. guest: small businesses are the engine of the economy. that is why we have spent some reach time -- so much time to agree on how we can help them grow and implementing a lot of things they talk about. we do live in a new world where a lot of direct investment is coming in through our country. if it is going to come in, would like to see it come in to delaware. i talked to a double of companies -- a number of countries -- number of companies
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who are interested in locating in delaware. the world we live in, the economy we live in a extends well beyond, steak's or our country's borders. or our country's borders. we speak freely with our congressional representatives about the uncertainty businesses face because of the sequestration issue, the uncertainty they faced months ago as a result of the fiscal cliff. installs business investment. we are strongly -- it stalls
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business investment. there is a lot of work still to do. host: a person on twitter asks if it is the corporate tax breaks that draw businesses to delaware. guest: delaware is known as a place for corporate governance. it is a lot everybody learns when they are in law school. we have the best courts in the country rent year after year after year. -- in the country ranked year after year after year. that is why so many businesses incorporate in delaware. it is the quality of all work force. our strategic location is equal between washington and new york.
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you can access of -- access to a huge group of taxpayers. that is a key reason why businesses are interested in delaware. host: what is the tax rate in delaware? guest: about 8.5%. we have incredibly low property taxes. we have a triple a rating from all three of the agencies. we have long been considered a model of fiscal management. companies appreciate it. host: the chair of the national association, governor jack markell of delaware.
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what does today's agenda looks like? guest: providing more employment opportunities for people with disabilities. it is something else with passionate about. we have been people who have the willingness, the ability to work. it wants to be part of the team and be productive and a and a paycheck. we will be hearing from the ceo of -- they want to be a part of the team and be productive and to earn a paycheck. we will be hearing from the ceo of walgreens. we will be learning how states can work with businesses. host: from texas on the
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democrats' line, good morning. caller: doesn't it one year or so ago when we have six democrats and six republicans who were supposed to come up with the budget cuts and they fail to do this a child and the sequestration was put in as a fail-safe? -- still to do their jobs and the sequestration was put in as a fail-safe? is that correct? guest: i am not sure of all of the details. we are hopeful we can get past this in a decent way. there is considerable work to be done. host: republican line from louisiana. caller: i understand your trip to india. i understand the fact that they have the people and the low pay
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raise and the taxes. are the governors in all states ever going to sit down and talk to the bigger companies and have a little more money right now and really, really tried to get companies in the united states -- really try to get companies in the united states to build more factories to come up less really try to do it in the united states -- willie tried to give companies in the united states -- mreally -- really try to get companies in the united states to build more factories?
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guest: in terms of the india piece, it was not going there in seeking lower wages. it was in recognition of the fact that india is the second fastest source of investment in this country. and businesses and decide -- when businesses decide where to expand, we want to advocate that businesses invest in new united states, build plans, put people to work here. most of us would love to see it. if that is going to happen, we want to see it happen in our state. the kinds of conversations she is asking about our taking place all the time.
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we are absolutely committed to seeing our small business grow. host: one more call from our test. -- one more call for our guest. caller: for those of us who do read state statutes and follow what you are writing, you are trampling on the first and second amendment of the u.s. constitution. if they state has slashed difficult times pain bills and getting their house in order, they are wasting hundreds of millions of dollars buying products from microsoft windows of us who are small business people who use fill labels --
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real labels cannot communicate with your system? judges in the state of delaware have had three trouble. coast and he will leave it there and nothing -- postal -- host: we will have to agree to disagree. we are not taking people's guns away. i did not understand the second part of the question. people are communicating with us all the time with every possible communications vehicle. if the caller has a more specific question, he can put it online at our office or call our
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office and we would be happy to talk to him. host: you are scheduled to have one more meeting with the president. what is on the agenda for that meeting? test the focus will be -- guest: the focus will be on making sure this country is a magnet for jobs and that people have the right skills. those are serious but become a and the administration can work together. host: covenant jack markell -- governor jack markell and the chair of the national governors' association. that is the room where all the action will be taking place
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later on this morning. can he place later on this program, we will have a discussion on domestic drones. hollen next guest will talk about some of the things -- to our next guest will talk about some of the privacy concerns with rooms. we will talk about the president also proposed a first on mapping the human brain. that discussion is coming up as "washington journal" continue it. -- continues. >> at age 25, she was one of the
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wealthiest winnows in the colonies. -- widows in the colonies. meet martha washington in the first program of c-span's new weekly series, "first ladies, influence & image." we will visit some of the places that influenced her life. b. parts of the conversation with your phone calls -- be part of the conversation on martha washington with your phone calls and tweets. >> it is pretty accurate they do not play by the rules. they bend the rules to fit their circumstance. americans tend to be a lot more legalistic. we want a news on a contract.
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-- when one thing is on a contract. the chinese will sign a contract and then figure out a way to try to get around it. it is a relentless drive to try to get ahead. it is what built the place over the last 30 years, the relentless drive to get ahead, to get better, to improve. they see us as trying to hold china down. now the we have gotten to be tough, we are trying to hamstring them or tie them up in a enough of schools and regulations. >> 34 years of reporting and in science around the world sunday at 8:00 p.m. on c-span's "q & a
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." >> "washington journal" continues. host: our guest right now is ben gielow. tell us what your association is and who you represent. guest: we are in the world's largest and oldest trade organization that represents unmanned air systems. we have 600 corporate members from all over the world. >> when you say unmanned air systems, the you mean drones -- do you mean drones? guest: it is the station and the pilot. it is more than just the
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vehicle. host: there is a perception about what a drone is. what do you hear and what is the reality? >> when we talk about the civil and commercial use of aircraft in the air space, we are talking about different systems from what the military uses. if you ask someone on the street what they think of when they hear the word drone, they will say they think of a large, weaponized system. unmannedght a small aircraft. it is used for farming and rescue. this is the type of system we are talking about. host: tell us what this does. guest: it is manufactured in
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germany. it has been in use in europe for about 10 years. it is meant to be from within the visual line of sight of the pilot on the ground. it is always in control of the pilot. it has a small camera on the bottom that is used to gain better situational awareness. in the united states, it is limited. in germany and other places in europe, this system is being used for agriculture applications to help farmers monitor their crops, to monitor wildfires, to check to see if there are people in burning buildings. law enforcement uses and for search and rescue. it is being used for infrastructure monitoring so you can fly under a bridge to see if
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there is any structural damage. host: how far justice goh? what powers it? guest: -- host: how far does this go? what powers it? guest: this is the camera portion suspended from the aircraft. host: the top part, what is that? guest: the pilot will control it. it can actually find preprogrammed route you want to program. if you have a firm field, you can program the boundaries of
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your field and take pictures -- if you have a farm field, you can program the boundaries of your field then take pictures. host: the average person is saying, why can this thing spy on me one day? guest: we are trying to get out to is a case people on how the systems will be and will not be used and what their capabilities are. we know the public has some concerns and we want to have an open net on this -- an open and honest conversation. there are a lot of things that need to be resolved from a safety and security standpoint and from a privacy standpoint. here is a lot that needs to be done before you see thesis is flying in the national air base -- before you see these things
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flying in the national air and space. a lot of states are following bills introduced last year in the u.s. congress. there are some privacy groups that are pushing bills. the civil libertarian folks are working with privacy groups on these issues. they are concerned with law enforcement and government use of these systems to spy on people. host: their concerns are valid or no? guest: there is a route must -- a robust legal framework about how law-enforcement can use airborne assets to monitor people or activities. here are more requirements already in excess the would-in existence that govern when and how the federal government --
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there are more requirements already in existence that would govern when and how the federal government can use these systems. host: if you want to ask our guest question, you can start doing so now. for republicans, it is 202-737- 0001. for democrats, it is 202-737- 0002. for independents it is 202-628- 0205. let's talk about the privacy concerns. we'll be joined on the phone by satyendra huja, the mayor of charlottesville. you have the first state that has passed a law on drones.
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guest: we feel it is a violation of privacy and constitutional rights. there is no law at the federal or state level to use these drones. host: tell us about the short history about how you came to pass the resolution. guest: there is an institute based in charlottesville, virginia. you are required to have a warrant. we need to have rules and guidelines for drones are used.
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host: what kind of clarifications are your citizens looking for a? -- said this is looking for -- citizens looking for? has the commonwealth of virginia reacted to this at all? guest: we ask for intended to have a two year moratorium. host: within the city of charlottesville, are there any types of drones be used commercially or otherwise? does the police department have been him guilty of using these general test and they cannot use
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these for a least 8 years -- does the police department have the authority to use these rooms -- means mdrones -- dron s./ - fdrones. -- drones? guest: there is no reason to think the courts cannot handle this issue. if you are going to put someone under surveillance when they have a right to privacy, you have to get a search warrant regardless of the technology being used. that could be for thermal camera
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senate is just as applicable to unmanned aircraft. a lot of folks feel the fourth amendment does not offer enough protections. why do you think that? why do you think that if you give this new tool to law enforcement, they will start violating people's privacy. there are organizations that do fly on an aircraft. they do not use them to spy on -- there are organizations that do fly these aircraft, but they do not use them to spy. host: ben gielow is our guest to talk about domestic unmanned vehicles. rose is on our independent line. go ahead.
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caller: i have a comment and a question. the reason i am and independent is because of this issue. the 70,000 rooms that were approved by congress, both parties, including my two senators from tennessee, is another issue where congress enacts something and does not ask the question about what is the into result. we have a president who thinks it is all right to kill american citizens overseas. what is to keep that from happening here in our own country? what if a terrorist decides to use a drone? you can get instructions on how to construct them on the internet. what is to keep a terrorist from
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weaponize in a drone? guest: what congress passed a little over a year ago was an faa modernization bill that requires the faa to find out how unmans aircraft will be able to safely operate in the national -- how unmanned aircraft will be able to safely operate in the national airspace. the safety of the national airspace is the main concern of the faa. that is what congress directed the faa to work on. i have until 2015 to do that. with regard to your question about potential terrorists getting this technology, there is a difference between an unmanned aircraft and what is referred to as massachusetts --
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.odelists can buy whatever you need to find and -- a recreational airplane. folks have lacy concern that you have. the faa will need to -- folks of raised the concern that you have. the fda will need to look closely at the issue. there was an individual who bought a model airplane off of the internet and wanted to put explosives into it and fly it into the pentagon. he was arrested and he is spending a long time in prison. host: 1400 permitted operators
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since 2007. as soon as say there will be 10,000 rooms by 2020. guest: those numbers have come from the faa. it stems upon when he of a and will write safety rules to allow these aircraft to fly. the faa has approved 250 public agencies to fly these aircraft. that is primarily the military. it could be customs and border protection flying on the southern border for border security missions. public universities are using them for agriculture research and looking at a lot of technological challenges the still need to be met. host: how does a drone overhead differ from manned aircraft? guest: and is a good question. the reason you would fly and unmans aircraft -- unmanned
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aircraft is that it has a sensor or a camera to gather information. that technology exists. this is a new truck. the truck is part of this system. it is not the reason you fly. you fly it because you want to gather the information. the sensors already exists today. that is a misconception a lot of folks have. when they think of the term trone, they think it is carrying some new technology. how do they differ between manned and unmanned? ned can fly and unman
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aircraft into hot spots where people might be trapped. it was flown in japan after the earthquake. it does things that humans cannot do or that are too whiskey. host: can they get as high as manned aircraft? guest: the term unmanned aircraft is all encompassing. it can be something that fits in the palm of your hands. there is a big difference between those systems and the capabilities. host: cfa have to deal with how these vehicles ride alongside the manne aircraftd.
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the few exceptions have been missing. it has to do with the line of sight of the pilot on the ground. he reasons to avoid conflicts in the national air system and to insure the person operating a figure of chilly and the system to avoid hitting potential collision. there is a lot of work the still means to be done on the lunch assistance. how are they going to avoid manned craft? there is a lot of work being done in that area. the pilot is on the ground, so he is not looking at out of the windchills. developed. caller: everybody has all these
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assurances. this information together can possibly be used for spying on me. we are pending all of our hopes that one supreme court justice is replaced. all this stuff goes out of the window. that is a huge leap of faith. i do not trust it. that been -- guest: thanks for that question. the question is, what of the legal parameters. he sensors on unmanned aircraft are no different from the sensors that are in existence. the -- you probably have one of the close to you. we need to have a national
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conversation about data protection at large. an unmanned vehicle is a truck, but it is canada data. that is when this conversation should be focused. the- -- an unmanned fickle is a truck, but it is collecting data. host: to learn to operate them carry liability insurance of any kind? guest: the department of defense is seeking to better. once it gets into commercial and civil hands, who knows where this industry is going to take off. we are going to have to see. this is a bit to come system.
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a larger system can be run by gasoline. the is some development work looking a solar or other types of proportion. that is being considered. host: can anybody pick one of these up? guest: you can buy it. if you can fight it or not is an issue that needs to be taken up with the faa. as soon as you start flying in for a commercial purpose -- let's say you are a realtor and you want to take pictures of a property, that in choosing gray area. the faa and can this commercial activities differently from the way it relates other activities. because in the $10,000 range. -- a cost within the $10,000 range.
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a lot of police departments to not have millions of dollars to spend on a manned aircraft. for tens of thousands of dollars, you can get something that is limited in its capability. this can be stored in the trunk of the, and flown on demand as needed. -- the trunk of the car and flown on demand as needed. it will be similar to an unmanned aircraft. you can pull this out of the trunk of your car, take photographs of the entire scene and move all of the cars out and get traffic going again. host: call from michael in
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springfield, oregon. caller: this is a lot of -- this is a good time for america to canada of the guns. -- to get rid ofthe guns. -- rid of mthe mguns -- get rid of the guns. test and you can get small systems that can fly for a few minutes that has limited capabilities. when you talk to a farmer, agriculture will be the biggest market for this aircraft trillion that will be called presaging agriculture. you will be using that g.p.s.
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wins points to see what needs water and what he's pesticides -- using etf -- gps wavepoints see what needs to be watered and what needs pesticides. it has limited capabilities, 20 minutes. it has enough to get the information you need. the amount be larger systems. they might not be commercially viable because you are talking about a lot of money. a farmer was this system that tends of thousands of dollars. you are talking tens of millions of dollars for the military or the border patrol. host: this is coming from oscar j. he radio model planes have been flying unmanne aircraftd for
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more than a decade. --aircraft for more of an a decade. caller: dorner ex-policeman he was corrupt. throughout his career. you say they have to get a search warrant, but they can do whatever they want to to invade my privacy. what insurance and the people have that they will not be invaded? guest: i do not want to speak for law enforcement. i have been working with them quite a bit on this technology. he recognized this potential and they are sensitive to the concerns you and others have expressed on this. their response would be, we use a lot of technology that could potentially violate your
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privacy, was it the internet searches or thermal camera is our regular chemists. they do not violate your privacy because they have checks and balances. it ensures the technology is used responsibly. if it is not, the people who abuse it are punished. he needed a search warrant to use information in if you violate someone's privacy rights if law enforcement use aircraftned incorrectly, we're very sensitive to the american intrusion into our lives. transparency is a key on this issue. ultimately, having police
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department's open and transparent about their interest in these things, how they will use them, and have the modifications, how're you find things, i think, that is the best way to approach these things. host: ron paul wrote about this. guest: there is a lot there that we absolutely don't agree with. we agree that a search warrant is needed any time the government wants to surveil you and you have the right to privacy. that is the current law today regardless of the technology. the problem is that the bill he introduced in congress goes further and changes the war requirement.
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while the changes may be spawn, the language in his bill would create a very different set of law for unmanned aircraft that would fermanagh-for manned aircraft. it would prevent law enforcement from using unmanned aircraft list begun a search 1 beforehand. -a search warrant before hand. there are a lot of reasons why you wouldn't have a search warrant. his bill would apply to manned aircraft. so it is ok to use a manned aircraft and not manned air-but not an unmanned aircraft? there's still a pilot controlling the mission and is accountable for that mission. host: tony is from austin, texas. caller: the battlefield is
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growing small and remote and there's nothing we can do about it. i want the technology. if the government is good to have it. number two, we must control it, the government at every turn. at the beginning of the segment, you looked at the camera and you said why would you have concern for this, you use the word "y." all tell you why. our government is corrupt. you have to realize the opposition comes from the published knowledge that the public-that the government is corrupt. guest: that was a statement and a lot of people have the same view. we trust law enforcement to trust us-to protect us. we used -- we trust firefighters
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to protect us. this is a tool. this is technology that is maturing. it is not very difficult for you to go to one of these. the technology is there today. what we're really focused on is how will the faa regulates these things and how will they be used? host: years and that, if a hobbyist want to go to wherever they buy, they'll have to put my affirmation about the purposes for what they want other than 125 on the weekend with my kids? guest: in the death they bill the congress passed last year, there was a specific exemption for the modeling community. it is important to note that unmanned aircraft has evolved
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almost as bad as manned aircraft almost a hundred years. it is a common pastime, modeling. you can use than for a whole host of different things. woodhull will clearly be regulated? host: when those issues are decided, will the faa be the final authority? guest: the faa regulates our national airspace, so anything that flies. the faa doesn't really get involved in the purpose of the flight and i don't think that we-that they should get involved. they should be regulating the use for privacy issues. host: how will they simply 5-how will they simply fly with the
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man aircraft? what policies to they have a place? host: who would take that over? the fbi guest? guest: the president would have to provide policy guidances for that. in geographic areas where they can be fun with manned aircraft, they can figure out what are these issues the need to be addressed. what is the did the needs to be built up to ensure that, on a worldwide search failed-on a worldwide scale basis, this can be efficient. that will be in something that the test site proponents will
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have to address. host: what type of industries do you represent? guest: we represent the unmanned systems industry. we have done so for 40 years. so we represent the ground and air systems. you will see more robotic technology being used on a daily basis, whether is driverless cars or autonomous underwater systems mapping the sea floor, or testing more quality or unmanned aircraft for a whole host of uses, like firefighting or agricultural pipeline serving size and others-pipeline surveillances and others. a lot of this technology has to
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start the been driven by the department of defense. however, as this technology matures, it really is moving over to the civil and commercial areas. although the u.s. has been a big driving factor behind r&d in this, the rest of the world is also pursuing this technology for military and for a civilian purposes. host: taste and arizona, and joe, good morning. joe, your online, go ahead. >> i think this gentleman must be on a different planet. my feelings are that he has the forgotten one thing. first of all, he can depend on congress-he cannot depend on commerce. second, the government does not have the right to spy on us. if you want to start a revolution in this country, you are about to. so here's my point you very simply.
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if you believe so strongly that the government won't use it improperly, or do provide federal charges of 15 years in prison at a minimum for misusing it? you talk about transparency? i don't know what planet you're on, a partner, but i can tell you this. there is no transparency. guest: i would say that any technology can be abused. any technology can be used for good and for bad. the question we really need to address is how will we ensure that those who do use it for bad are punished and held accountable? host: ohio, mike, and an allied- .ndependent line calle
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caller: number one, you have heard of one was wiretaps. no. 2, the police has no need of a warrant to search your car. no. 3, henry kissinger wiretapped all kinds of people one time. host: what's the point? caller: last week, the head of the faa was in a meeting. there were given a set of tasks in may last year. three of the goals that they said they have never even met yet, one of which is setting up the majors for what they had to do, what it was done and who was supposed to do it. host: what's your question? caller: one more point.
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host: no, our guest hester respond. guest: there is a lot of legal precedents for when it is permissible for the garment can use a wire tap. you made reference to a gps tracking case. that is known as the jones case that the u.s. supreme court ruled on. would it ruled on is that it is unconstitutional for the federal government or for government in general to put a physical gps tracking device on your car to monitor your daily driving habits, where you are and where you're going. that case was pretty narrowly tailored, that it was just a physical trespass and that was ruled on. there were some issues raised by some other justices in the dissenting opinion talking about technological advancement, how we will do with people's
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expectations of privacy. anple's right to privacy is ever-evolving kind of legal issue. it needs to continually be addressed. i fully disagree that the court will look at these issues as they come about. the new technology is very limited in how it's being used. i am aware one legal case where an unmanned aircraft was used the least of part to help upper hand a dangerous person. and that issue was raised and the judge threw out because he said the the unmanned aircraft was not the issue. that was not why law enforcement was a resting him-was arresting him. host: 2 you bet? -d u -- do you envision the supreme court challenge on this?
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guest: but forging new technologies on this. it will work its way up, sure. whether the supreme court hears it, i don't know. host: do you envision a special court for drone use or unmanned vehicle used? guest: i am not an expert on national security law. but whether the fed the government can listen on conversations of a potential terrorist for bad guy, they do look at that. whether a whole new special court used to be created around this come-and another that will be practical. this is a small system annual see it routinely used. the court system we have now is amply qualified to handle these issues. host: alabama, antonia, good morning.
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whatr: i don't understand these guys talking about with the government and everything. the what about the law enforcement that is already profiling guys. why give them another tool to infringe upon people's first amendment rights? now they're talking about second man and-second amendment rights and all that. what makes people think that they can control this? guest: thank you. ultimately, transparency is the key here, having public accountability for how government uses this new technology, like the use any technology. hopefully it, if a law enforcement agency or fur department is interested in this
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technology, they will be open about it. there will invite their constituents, invite the public in coming by the media in, show a demo on how the system will be used. i would like to emphasize that the international association of chiefs of police is the world's largest police chief organization. they came up with the guidelines for how police departments should use unmanned aircraft. they were very specific about transparency and accountability and it's our hope that agencies that are interested in this technology will look to their guidelines, adopt them or version of it to ensure that there is accountability. host: thank you for holding on. go ahead. i have 20 acres.
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how many feet into the air to lie on in the airspace above my property? and if i do, how many feet? guest: that is an excellent question, a simple question. over a hundred years ago, before aviation, the english common law was that, if you own your property, up to the heavens and that anyone who did anything over, that would be trespass for which you could file suit against them. but with the advent of commercial aviation, that all changed. congress got involved. the court system got involved and said the that kind of law is not practical. we have to allow for interstate commerce and the travel of people. so they allow for manned aircraft to fly over your property at all different types of the tubes. there is a little bit a precedent here in that the supreme court has made a couple
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of rulings looking at law enforcement use of helicopters. they say it is ok to fly a helicopter 400 feet above an individual's property. and whatever they see there is in plain view because everyone has the right to fly at that altitude in a helicopter. if they see marijuana growing, they should be able to use that. for a fixed wing aircraft, that is 1,000 feet. the court also about that in a different opinion. the reason for these requirements is that they looked at the at a safety rules. at what height was it safe to fly an unmanned platform? what is the navigable airspace going to be for an unmanned aircraft? that is an issue that we don't know yet. host: as far as what happens on capitol hill, where is the reaction of what can happen in
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the future? we know the faa has weighed in. but what about capital bill that to ec legislation on this issue? guest: congress-the one about capitol hill? do we see legislation on this issue? guest: congress wants to educate the public on this issue. the public does have preconceived notions about this. is it proper to put extra requirements in this technology or should we look at dated issues, camera issues more broadly--- dated issues, ken mehsud more broadly? there have been bills introduced -- data issues, camera issues more broadly?
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there have been bills introduced. host: auvsi.org is their website if you want to learn more about their organization. last up, we will look of a new federal efforts that looks at the human brain. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013] >> i am sure that you're familiar with malcolm x. he was supposedly the man in favor of violence. that was not the issue. he didn't support the right of that -- he did support the right of armed personal protection.
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but he did not promote the use of aggression. we have to build our own forces until they have no choice but to recognize their demands. that is power. and he called this black nationalism. he built up a whole ideology batted. it is what is behind -- a whole ideology about it. he believing community control schools. yes, he believes in block autonomy. he is not an integrationist as such. he said, it is up to us. it's our show. >> howard berg looks at black power tonight at midnight eastern, part of american history tv on c-span 3.
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>> at age 25, she was one of the wealthiest widows in the colonies. during the revolution, she was considered an enemy by the british to threatened to ticker hostage. later, she would become our nation's first first lady at age 57. meet martha washington monday night in c-span new weekly series "for sleaze, influence and image-"first ladies, influence and image." live monday night at 9:00 p.m. eastern on c-span, c-span radio and c-span.org. >> "washington journal" continues. host: it was during the state of the union when the president talked about his desire for research of the brain. >> [video clip]
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>> if we want to make the best products, we have to invest in the best ideas. every dollar that we invested in the human genome return $40 to our economy. today, scientists are mapping the human brain to unlock the answers to alzheimer's. host: joining us from boston is george church. he is a genetic professor. thank you for joining us. guest: it is great to be here. host: what is the president proposing? guest: he has been speaking in broad strokes. decline address the science of the brain activity map -- i
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addressed the science of the brain activity map. it is to improve our clinical supplications of milling and stimulating and large number of neuron circuits for human and animal behavior. host: can you talk about where the federal government comes and in? guest: we are very much talking about research that is already done, but the opportunity to make it more cost-effective for all of the research that is done, it is on the order of half a billion dollars on research that is done. we brought the cost down about a millionfold in last decade into genomics. if we could do it here, it would be a huge impact on both
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research and clinical applications. host: on the science aside, what does it mean to map the human brain? guest: it's important to think of this as a static map, like a street map. this is a dynamic one that can be personalized from person to person and moment to moment. it is technology that enabled us to look at a fine level of individual norms-individual neurons. it provides a way to look at our brain acts in normal activity and to fix it in real time. host: 50 federal government gets involved, what difficulty are we talking about? guest: the opportunities here,
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we have the example of brain monitoring, like cochlear implants and retinal and plaques and brain stem injury or you can get a paraplegic to be able to move objects. these are great challenges. we have a little bit of activity clinically that you will be able to put in a dozen electrodes, maybe a hundred. but to get the fine structure, you need to get something between the hundreds that we can do and the hundred billion that this in the brain. that is a significant challenge that can be addressed by synthetic technology and new fiber-optic and so on. host: on the research side, you would find the subject to help you with this. how does that work? guest: we already have clinical
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applications that involve research subjects that have a lot to gain. some experiments will be done in animals to develop the technology and make sure that it's safe. i think that this can go well beyond the applications that we already have in place for electrodes and become much less invasive and apply to neuro generative and psychiatric methods. host: what does it do for how we handle our emotions? what does it do for memory, especially if you survive an accident and things like that? will those areas be improved or the ability to understand the various be improved because of what we're doing or what is being proposed?
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guest: i think those and many others. what is important is for us to not overpromise on a particular disease and a particular date. but what we can do is make strong efforts to bring down the cost to improving quality-to improve quality and the methods and the complete comprehensiveness. we can improve the technology. this would be great for researchers and clinicians worldwide. it is also an opportunity for the united states to continue technology leadership. host: a proposal to improve-a proposal to map the human brain. if you want to ask him questions, here's how you can do s.
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you can treat us--- you can tweet us. guest: the original project for the human genome was to simply sequence postings that compose our human genome, but it's also to compare the human genome and trades and the project has been quite large.
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the technology that we can now apply in clinical studies for measuring carrier status for various inherited diseases, cancer and so forth, this is really playing now quite amazingly in the marketplace and in research labs all of the world. host: our first call is from james, clifton springs, republican line. go ahead. caller: i had an mri on my brain for supposedly dementia. and i almost got a kick out of it because i do not have dementia at all. i also give you credit for
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working with ted kennedy's issue of the brain, which can be wonderful. the other issues that, through time, we have become involved with improving and hoping, like you said, the cost. the other issue that stands real tall is the equipment that we use where people, dementia or alzheimer's -- i know that alzheimer's is mainly for cpa, bookkeeping, a very close friend of mine has alzheimer's one. and some people make a lot on one of them. i think that needs to be stopped. guest: i think you raise a number of important questions, white how will we get
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diagnostics -- like how will we get diagnostics. and a lot of that is already in place. the cost is important and you will see that continuing be. hopefully, there will be many diseases that will be impacted. there is not a cure all or one- size-fits-all. this can encourage small science and various forms. host: professor church, how does the brown worked? with that in mind, what is being proposed by this mapping project? guest: the general architecture of the brain and the general
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operations of the cellular level are understood. what is missing are the things in between, the things between them to low resolution structure and activity that you can see and the very fine grained things that we can do at amazing levels. that needs to be connected. there's this whole interesting realm where you have a hundred billion neurons that interact and being able to monitor many of them at once is possible, not to because of our increased competition ability with models and feedback to stimulate, but through nanotechnology is and find tropical technologies-and
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-- and finer technologies. caller: do you think that more industries will come out of brain mapping? guest: there are already a number of relevant industries, which include imaging, which is diagnostic, deep brain stimulation for epilepsy and relatively crude treatments that can be greatly improved. so that infrastructure is in place and we hope to improve its by factors of 10 on a regular basis. there are less obvious industries. for example, artificial intelligence and big data. they can work on how the human
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brain works or they can manage the gigantic tsunami of data that will flow out of the sort of project, both research and clinical. host: dr. church, "the financial times" had an article on the blue brain project. can you expand on that? guest: as we do with the genome project, we hope to have an internationally coordinated project. it will include computational modeling. but the emphasis will be on measurement and simulation and
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test the models that are developing computers. if is critical to cornet the models of the measurements and the tests of them. host: the key from florida, good morning. caller: i was just wondering, with regard to jeans, we discover that the presence of research and gene would come with certain behavior. how can this work with children who have schizophrenia and things like that that can be detected early? i would think that brain mapping would be a priority for those kind of people. host: there are 5 million
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americans living with alzheimer's. it is the sixth leading cause of death in the u.s. will this research help those conditions later on or alleviate them? guest: ok, so the caller correctly reminds us that genetics and stem cell therapy and so forth are extremely important parts of the research and future clinical aspects of brain technology and science. we need to emphasize those along with the brain activity map. this will lead to tremendous opportunities for synergy. we need to -- back to the question a predisposition to certain genetic disorders, in some cases, this is highly
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accurate. meeting highly predictable. in other cases, less so. it is important to consider the environmental components. that is really still in the future for many of these uses and integrating genetics and the environment. being able to monitor brain activity in a high granular ready-granularity in the activity of the brain and the final outcomes many years later. i think it's important to try to be as -- to encourage these technologies to be more accurate in our diagnoses. host: miami beach, fla. on the democrats' line. caller: dr. church, i have a question in terms of the technology that you will use.
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with them our eyes-with mri's been pets, we can use them with animals. if we are able to use it for task in the right human brain, how will that help technologies? guest: we're talking about a broad range of technologies. any improvement in the current imaging methods, whether it is fmri or zmri or other methodologies, would be welcome and integrated with electrodes and optical fiber methods, which for the most part the optical methods used in animal so far. the opportunity here is to
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increase the opera-increase the technology more rapidly. host: "the washington post "said it is easy to see how a company such as google can build new grain assistance that mimics the activity of the human brain. on twitter, we have a viewer who last -- guest: i think it's a little hard to predict where this is going. i think we need ethical, legal, social oversight at every stage. i think we need to also avoid over promising, if these are
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considered desirable. but certainly, if any of those are to happen, then there will be projects like this to get us close enough so that we can do this in a safe and productive manner. host: can you expect--- can you expand on the ethical oversight on these matters? guest: we have seen there is a need to think of all the different ways, the risks and benefits of how this can go right and wrong and anticipate those years and events and a time when that does not seem urgent. we have such conversations going on already and hope to have more
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as this project to build up. host: independent line. good morning. curious whether or not there has been a base theorem applied to try to estimate the pretest probability that we will find anything that is worth the cost. if you use it for a base ceram, you need to have a probability that you have a positive or a negative outcome. you also have to have a post- test results. using those two, you can determine whether the pretense probability was close enough to the post-test reality to justify the cost of such a huge project. if it doesn't match with the
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base theorem, how do you justify spending all this money mapping random things on rap been -- mapping random things on random people? or if you mistakenly correlate to things or more between one individual and another, then correlation is not related to causality and you end up with more information than you want to do with, it seems like. host: caller, thank you. guest: you raise some interesting points, things that are on our from lines of inquiry. the hope is to bring down the cost of ongoing research. there will be some investment required to do that and it's hard to just apply something
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theoretical, like based theorem, in advance. but i think we can see president--- we can see precedence. there are often times lower costs and higher quality that have resulted. in this particular case, we want to be attentive to the cost effectiveness, as you would for any diagnostic or therapeutics going forward. host: what was the cost of the genome product? can you compare this to the federal money that would be necessary to make this happen? guest: the cost of the genome project was originally estimated and delivered at about $3 billion. i think that the costs have come
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down considerably. the teleport that obama referred to was estimated at 140 return on investments. that report says that that could as well over time. it is quite remarkable to see it happening so quickly. one last point on the previous callers question about getting information applying to one person and not another, having this personalized is technology that we can use did today on an individual. and a question about correlation vs causation, if we can not only measure but stimulate neurons as occurs in certain clinical procedures already, for epilepsy
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and so on, then we can test hypotheses from the beginning of the project. one of the hopes is to not deflect a one-size-fits-all dataset, but to test causality as we go along and technology that is applicable in many people real time. host: how long list of the research take, do you think? guest: it is a been that may be better off, without -- may be better off without a strict deadline. we hope that there will be a moment or two along the brain active the map or we can say, aw heck, we now have technology that is capable, ok, we now have
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the technology that is capable to do what we want to do. host: donald from texas. caller: thank you. good morning. basically, i have a cleft lip and palate. a lot of doctors have told me -- hello? host: you are on. go ahead. caller: what doctors have told me is that it is not genetic. i can tell you, throughout my family, i have 45 in my family over several generations that have this -- i have four or five in my family over several generations that have this. i am for anything that is -- if
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you can find out for any reason things that can basically cause certain things, certain disorders or whatever, i am all for that. host: thank you, caller. guest: this is an important point, that the brain that should be integrated with other neuroscience efforts, including narrowgenetics -- including neurogenetics. host: we are talking about budget cuts that will go into effect next week. does the national institute get affected? could that proved to be a difficulty? guest: really, i can only address the science with any expertise. but i can offer my personal
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opinion. many projects like this to inspire the american public to get back to his leadership position and to bring down costs and improve productivity. hopefully, they will see this as a reason to get our act together financially and start finding some of those things that actually keep our country going. guest: probably, the simplest -- no, it's not hard wired. all the way up to very old age, we're learning that the wiring is changing. we can learn our whole life. but there is a lot that is wired
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up by your genetics and by yearly expenses. it is that continuum that we will learn a great deal more about as we go forth. host: lincoln, calif., democrats line. caller: thank you for taking my call. thank you for c-span. my question goes to -- i guess it relates to an earlier question -- but how would you incorporate in your project, either your assumptions or structures, the fact that different parts of the brain can be used for different things in different individuals? for example, people who are blind from birth use their visual cortex for their senses and other things. so there seems to be a huge variability from individual to individual. how do you incorporate that into your project, in your structure assumptions?
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guest: that is a beautiful question. i think it reflects our effort to make technology so expensive that it can be used for personalized medicine in the same since the genomics is no inexpensive enough -- is now inexpensive enough to have genetic diagnosis and personalized therapies. in this case, it is wonderful how plastic the brain is, how adaptable it can be in the examples you gave. we hope this will allow us to leverage that when we get to therapies so that we can now see purpose in different parts of the brain that compensate for either genetic, and environmental board damage- related pathologies.
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host: david e. goldman-david eagleman writes -- any response to that, professor? guest: i think that is right on target. it is very poetic and accurate. the challenges in front of us. what is terrific about our new science, astrophysics, particle
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physics, genome, and so on, coming up with models that coalesce the data into something that is coherent and most importantly be able to tested come in this case, that is one of our top priorities, but to take this cacophony from hundreds of billions of neurons and turn them into models that can guide stimulation patterns and ultimately therapies. host: virginia, independent line. caller: thank you for having this conversation. i am sure that you're aware that their patents for advent -- that there are patents for advanced technologies. there is no dialogue about the
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research that already exists. there is support for victims were coming out in droves on the internet -- you can do google searches on targeted individuals, organized stalking -- and they are asking for help because there is misuse of directed weapon technology. whether it is a rogue government for research at universities, they are using this technology already and experimenting and testing on united states citizens illegally. the mpc affiliate in palm springs, calif. recently did a story on hundreds of people hearing voices. synthetic telepathy, jesse venture recently did an hour- long program on micro technology.
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right now, richard burr -- host: what is the question? caller: how you dress this technology that is already out there? host: thank you, caller. guest: i think that the sort of technology or talking about is still mostly in the future. as we mentioned earlier in the program, there is importance on having discussions about the ethical components. as each of these technologies could have incorporated into them monitoring so that we know how the insurance are being used for surveillance. i think it's relatively difficult to -- it will be
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difficult to work on communicating with the human brain without the full power dissipation and close proximity to the person in question. this project is not aimed at affecting prince in the distance, but having -- at affecting persons in a distance, but having effect on computer devices. host: how did you get involved in brain research? guest: i am a technologist from all the way back to myerlee education. -- to my early education. we have had a long interest in genetics and genomics and we
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have recently been developing technology that is applicable to this brain activity map. host: dr. george church talking about brain mapping. walden, new york, republican line, tom, good morning. caller: thank you first piece -- thank you for c-span. my wife and i have been working on my daughter's sleep disorder. i agree with his ethics concern. we are thankful for the ,echnology because of mri's which was not conclusive, but we had very since can that can prove disorder.
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is he in league with the private sector also or only the government? guest: i think that there are definite opportunities for integration with technologies, but also on behavior and neuro pathologies. it would be terrific if this is a well integrated project with integrated research, which is amazing and there are multiple fields letter adjacent to bring activities. host: arthur, democrats line. we're almost done. if you go straight to your question or comment please. caller: do you have any time frame as far as this mapping and what it would do to help with a brain disease like alzheimer's
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and maybe even criminology? host: professor church. guest: we hope the project as a whole will make major strides, may be factors of 10 improvement in cost effectiveness and accuracy over the next decade. alzheimer's and criminology may not be the top priorities nor the top payoffs for this project. possibly, in collaboration, working on genetics and stem cell technology, we can make a small contribution. criminology is a tall order we will have to see what we can do to contribute to the genetic, environmental, and brain activity component to that. host: another viewer on twitter asks gues
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guest: the variations on with his curly progressing, having to do with vision, hearing, spinal cord injuries, these could all be improved by orders of magnitude. i think that we can get to things that affect activity over large parts of the brain or the genetics is less clear and environmental opponents more important. possibly, such things as schizophrenia or other neera psychiatric disorders -- other neuro psychiatric disorders, these are things that will be pursued. pursued. host:

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